Agreed, the same offer was made to me at around $1200 if I recall correctly. Keep in mind that the man behind Westminster is also involved in Lumin. So there certainly is some reciprocal benefit from “up-selling” to that cable. Im curious to hear your impressions.
Replacement power cable for Lumin X1
- Thread starter BlueSky
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- Thread Author
- #22
Oh my. I didn't know that there was a "connection" between the two companies and now, that I know that, I am not sure how that makes me feel but it is what it is and "caveat emptor" always applies. Always do your due diligence when it comes to anything. BTW, the offer they made to you was pretty good in comparison.
I will be happy to let you know my thoughts on the new cable when I get it.
I will be happy to let you know my thoughts on the new cable when I get it.
- Thread Author
- #23
I received my new cable this morning. WestminsterLab used the fastest FedEx shipping method and I would have had it overnight except the US Customs folks needed to be satisfied that everything was on the up and up. Thanks for the quick shipping!
Opening the box caused me a bit of surprise. I believe that I had read somewhere that the new Lumin X1 power supply had used a 9-pin connector. To my surprise, the the new cable had 10-pin Hirose connectors which sent a chill up my spine. What if the new cable did not work?? Not to worry, because, when I checked the OEM cable, it was found to also be in a 10-pin configuration. Either the literature I read was wrong or my memory had failed.
In any event, before replacing the cable, I borrowed a friend's Keithley 2182A nano-volt meter to do some, probably useless, measurements of the noise at the output of the X1. I connected the meter to the X1's left channel XLR output terminated in a "dummy load" of 20kohms and played a track ripped from a "SilentCD". The tracks on this disk are described as absolute silence and, with the OEM cable, I measured an RMS voltage level of about .0063741mv which I assume is the noise level of the output. I then swapped in the new 0.6m Westminster cable with the optional carbon fiber wrap, played the same track and took the measurement. The RMS value of the noise I measured dropped from .0063741mv to .0042476mv. If my calculations are correct, that appears to be about a -3db drop in "noise" at the output just by changing from the long OEM to this shorter custom cable. I don't know what to attribute the loss to but maybe it's the shorter length and possibly the shielding of the cable. I am also not saying that the drop in output noise level would ever be audible but it is just a data point. (Please note that I was unable to hear any audible noise through the speakers that I could attribute to the X1 with my ear against the speaker's tweeter and mid range speakers with either cable.)
Keeping my fingers crossed, I am going to let the cable settle in for a while before doing any critical listening but I will post my findings when I get a chance to sit for a spell.
Opening the box caused me a bit of surprise. I believe that I had read somewhere that the new Lumin X1 power supply had used a 9-pin connector. To my surprise, the the new cable had 10-pin Hirose connectors which sent a chill up my spine. What if the new cable did not work?? Not to worry, because, when I checked the OEM cable, it was found to also be in a 10-pin configuration. Either the literature I read was wrong or my memory had failed.
In any event, before replacing the cable, I borrowed a friend's Keithley 2182A nano-volt meter to do some, probably useless, measurements of the noise at the output of the X1. I connected the meter to the X1's left channel XLR output terminated in a "dummy load" of 20kohms and played a track ripped from a "SilentCD". The tracks on this disk are described as absolute silence and, with the OEM cable, I measured an RMS voltage level of about .0063741mv which I assume is the noise level of the output. I then swapped in the new 0.6m Westminster cable with the optional carbon fiber wrap, played the same track and took the measurement. The RMS value of the noise I measured dropped from .0063741mv to .0042476mv. If my calculations are correct, that appears to be about a -3db drop in "noise" at the output just by changing from the long OEM to this shorter custom cable. I don't know what to attribute the loss to but maybe it's the shorter length and possibly the shielding of the cable. I am also not saying that the drop in output noise level would ever be audible but it is just a data point. (Please note that I was unable to hear any audible noise through the speakers that I could attribute to the X1 with my ear against the speaker's tweeter and mid range speakers with either cable.)
Keeping my fingers crossed, I am going to let the cable settle in for a while before doing any critical listening but I will post my findings when I get a chance to sit for a spell.
I input these values into a web site calculator and got -3.5dB.
- Thread Author
- #25
Peter, thanks for the correction. I am still a little surprised that I was able to detect any measurable difference at all but the nano-volt meter is pretty sensitive I guess. Now I wish I had an audio or spectrum analyzer to find out just where the noise frequencies that I am measuring reside. In any event this is pretty exciting to me.
- Thread Author
- #27
I have tried to upload a picture using the "manage attachments" function below and hope it "takes".
I, for one, have never been able to hear audible differences between line fuses but I will provide my thoughts regarding s.q. changes, plus or minus, at a later date. And because, hearing can be so subjective your mileage may vary of course. Since a cable swap can be accomplished in less than a minute, I should be able to do some comparisons without loosing the sense of what each cable "sounds" like.
I, for one, have never been able to hear audible differences between line fuses but I will provide my thoughts regarding s.q. changes, plus or minus, at a later date. And because, hearing can be so subjective your mileage may vary of course. Since a cable swap can be accomplished in less than a minute, I should be able to do some comparisons without loosing the sense of what each cable "sounds" like.
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- #28
I’ve listened to the system now for four or five hours with the new cable and my initial impressions are that the music emerges from a darker, more velvety background. Before the cable swap, I used to have to almost strain to enjoy the opening bars of Leonard Slatkin and the Orchestre National de Lyon’s rendition of Ravel’s Bolero in 192khz 24bit. Either due to the drop in noise floor and/or increase in my system’s ability to reveal more of the low-level information, i.e. “microdynamics” (?), brought by the WestminsterLab cable, my system now allows me to become fully involved in the music without having to ride the gain control early on in the piece. Also, on Shelby Lynne’s “Just A Little Lovin’, also at 192khz 24bit, the cymbals shimmer a bit more to my liking and the drum rim shots seem to have quite a bit more “attack” or sharper transients in the opening sequence. Finally, in Leopold Ludwig and the LSO’s version of Dvorak’s New World Symphony also in 192khz 24bit, the English Horn solo in the Largo, or second movement, is the best I’ve ever heard it. Although I didn’t do any A/B comparisons to the cable I do intend to revisit that idea at some point.
I was kind of hoping for some increases in the width and depth of the X1’s already exceptional 3D sound stage but haven’t notice any so far. The X1 continues to hide the B&W 800’s from view with a sound stage that expands far outside the L/R and front to back physical placement of the speakers in my room. With the X1, I just don’t perceive that the sound is coming from a physical pair of speakers in the room.
I was kind of hoping for some increases in the width and depth of the X1’s already exceptional 3D sound stage but haven’t notice any so far. The X1 continues to hide the B&W 800’s from view with a sound stage that expands far outside the L/R and front to back physical placement of the speakers in my room. With the X1, I just don’t perceive that the sound is coming from a physical pair of speakers in the room.
I was just talking to our product managers yesterday that the one time I got many visitors telling me they loved the SQ of our Lumin S1 setup in Hong Kong audio exhibition was when we were using B&W 800D several years ago. B&W is a really popular brand in my location, with a very robust used market. When I was in high school, my physics teacher also said he used B&W speakers. Two people in our company own B&W speakers.
Phil A
Member
B&W makes some really nice speakers at different price points. I still have a pair in a spare system (which is basically a UHD home theater system) of P6s (I think they were $1,600 new so they weren't anywhere near the top of the line) which I bought when then were new in 1997. I had a friend over recently who wanted to hear my various back-ups systems (he never heard any of them except my main system). I played music files using my Panasonic UB-9000 and he was quite blown away of how good the system sounded. They image quite nicely.
To increase the width and depth of ones system. The easiest and cheapest way is by adjusting you speaker/listening placement and room treatment. But you have managed to "hide" your speaker so I would think you have done a great job and it won't be easy to find another sweet spot without any drawbacks.
A.
eickenho,
I have not done alternating testing of the two cables yet, since getting Steve's cable, but I will soon. It is a bit of a hassle challenge changing cables on the XI, especially the power cord. I made another change during the past month by replacing footers with A/V RoomService EVP ones. I wanted to get used to the changes there plus I don't believe Steve's cable went through the normal cable cooking option he offers with other cables. I wanted to let the new cable settle in for a bit. I purchased the EVP feet with felt, which will allow me to pivot the X1 around more easily to access the cord on the rear while keeping the feet in place. I will make a point of comparing the cords in the next week.
I have not done alternating testing of the two cables yet, since getting Steve's cable, but I will soon. It is a bit of a hassle challenge changing cables on the XI, especially the power cord. I made another change during the past month by replacing footers with A/V RoomService EVP ones. I wanted to get used to the changes there plus I don't believe Steve's cable went through the normal cable cooking option he offers with other cables. I wanted to let the new cable settle in for a bit. I purchased the EVP feet with felt, which will allow me to pivot the X1 around more easily to access the cord on the rear while keeping the feet in place. I will make a point of comparing the cords in the next week.
eickenho,
I owe you some thanks--your inquiry stimulated me to do comparisons of the stock vs. AudioSensibility DC cable. As always in these things, results in your personal system may vary from mine. I played music for about an hour before making changes today. I find letting the tubes settle in for an hour or so gives a better presentation.
As backround, I leave power on constantly with the Lumin X1 PSU. I am using a Vinnie Rossi L2 Signature DHT preamp with 300B Living Voice DHT tubes. After release of Leedh Processing, I have experimented with going direct to an active crossover and really liked the dynamics and transparency. I considered eliminating my preamp. Voice clarity was there in spades, but I felt I was missing what I considered as more natural and realistic voice qualities. I made some cabling changes and feel the Vinnie Rossi provides more of that quality I was seeking.
After the hour of playing, I turned off the VR preamp, used the Lumin App to power down the X1 and then shut off the X1 PSU. I had hoped I would be able to move the X1 and PSU around easily without changing the position of the EVPs. I was naive on that. Movement of the units was easy, but the EVP footers did not stay in the same position. Unfortunately, that variable is very important. I have found in the past that positioning of various additional footers have an impact on presentation. I have a number of Herbie's Tenderfeet footers. I have noticed that positional changes make a difference in presentation. I initially tried these after initially using the standard supplied Lumin footers. I later on purchased a set of Daedalus DIDs. I preferred them over the Herbie's. I then later purchased 4 of the A/v RoomService Medium 2" EVPs. Later I added Low 2" EVPs under the X1 PSU. I prefer those over the others. All manifest differences with even small movements, but the EVPs seem the most sensitive to me. Even micro position changes slightly alters sound presentation to me. I would not have guessed that to be the case, but those changes are slight tuning factors. Due to not being able to exactly match their positioning with moving the X1 and PSU for cabling changes, there undoubetly are some presentation differences in my listening tests with the DC cables due to these feet changed positions.
I changed the AS cable for the stock Lumin one. I went through a list of songs I truly like of both male and female vocals that have varied texture. I used Roon with some of the music coming from my SonicTransporter i5 CDR server hard drive and some streaming form Qobuz. My initial impression was a bit more forward vocal presentation. I do not mind a bit more forward vocal presentation. All the song selections with the stock cable were certainly listenable and enjoyable. I did think, however, that a Paul Carrack Live: The Independent Years Volume 1 of Sllent Running, Live at Shephard's Bush Empire (Qobuz) was not as I had recalled recently. I changed the Lumin cable to the AudioSensibility one and moved the feet back to same approximate positions. I started with the Paul Carrack Silent Running again. I did notice real differences in the presentation. First, volume seemed higher at same preamp setting with more dynamics and information--instruments seemed more present, defined, and separated. Imaging was better and soundstage also seemed wider. While all the music selections seemed to share similar differences, some were far more subtle. I am not unhappy with the stock Lumin cord, but I am going to keep the AudioSensibility cord in place.
I am certainly not recommending everyone change their Lumin stock cord. However, if you are looking to go to a shorter cord or change for any reason, I would recommend consideration of AudioSensibility. I have a couple other items made by AudioSensibility and have been pleased.
I owe you some thanks--your inquiry stimulated me to do comparisons of the stock vs. AudioSensibility DC cable. As always in these things, results in your personal system may vary from mine. I played music for about an hour before making changes today. I find letting the tubes settle in for an hour or so gives a better presentation.
As backround, I leave power on constantly with the Lumin X1 PSU. I am using a Vinnie Rossi L2 Signature DHT preamp with 300B Living Voice DHT tubes. After release of Leedh Processing, I have experimented with going direct to an active crossover and really liked the dynamics and transparency. I considered eliminating my preamp. Voice clarity was there in spades, but I felt I was missing what I considered as more natural and realistic voice qualities. I made some cabling changes and feel the Vinnie Rossi provides more of that quality I was seeking.
After the hour of playing, I turned off the VR preamp, used the Lumin App to power down the X1 and then shut off the X1 PSU. I had hoped I would be able to move the X1 and PSU around easily without changing the position of the EVPs. I was naive on that. Movement of the units was easy, but the EVP footers did not stay in the same position. Unfortunately, that variable is very important. I have found in the past that positioning of various additional footers have an impact on presentation. I have a number of Herbie's Tenderfeet footers. I have noticed that positional changes make a difference in presentation. I initially tried these after initially using the standard supplied Lumin footers. I later on purchased a set of Daedalus DIDs. I preferred them over the Herbie's. I then later purchased 4 of the A/v RoomService Medium 2" EVPs. Later I added Low 2" EVPs under the X1 PSU. I prefer those over the others. All manifest differences with even small movements, but the EVPs seem the most sensitive to me. Even micro position changes slightly alters sound presentation to me. I would not have guessed that to be the case, but those changes are slight tuning factors. Due to not being able to exactly match their positioning with moving the X1 and PSU for cabling changes, there undoubetly are some presentation differences in my listening tests with the DC cables due to these feet changed positions.
I changed the AS cable for the stock Lumin one. I went through a list of songs I truly like of both male and female vocals that have varied texture. I used Roon with some of the music coming from my SonicTransporter i5 CDR server hard drive and some streaming form Qobuz. My initial impression was a bit more forward vocal presentation. I do not mind a bit more forward vocal presentation. All the song selections with the stock cable were certainly listenable and enjoyable. I did think, however, that a Paul Carrack Live: The Independent Years Volume 1 of Sllent Running, Live at Shephard's Bush Empire (Qobuz) was not as I had recalled recently. I changed the Lumin cable to the AudioSensibility one and moved the feet back to same approximate positions. I started with the Paul Carrack Silent Running again. I did notice real differences in the presentation. First, volume seemed higher at same preamp setting with more dynamics and information--instruments seemed more present, defined, and separated. Imaging was better and soundstage also seemed wider. While all the music selections seemed to share similar differences, some were far more subtle. I am not unhappy with the stock Lumin cord, but I am going to keep the AudioSensibility cord in place.
I am certainly not recommending everyone change their Lumin stock cord. However, if you are looking to go to a shorter cord or change for any reason, I would recommend consideration of AudioSensibility. I have a couple other items made by AudioSensibility and have been pleased.
I too found working with Steve pleasant business experiences. Please let us know your impressions of this cable in your system. With some pieces of equipment I have wondered if break in was as much about me becoming accustomed to changes in presentation as the units burning in with accumulated playing, I really believe break in was a real phenomenon with my Lumin X1. The AS DC cable sounded fine from the beginning to me, but do believe there has been enhancement in the music presentation as I have accumulated a month of playing my system with it. As noted prior, I made some other changes as well, but I perceived a real difference when I did comparisons with the stock cable and the AS recently. While some selections seemed more subtle, some seemed quite pronounced. I very much would like to know your impressions as it settles into your system.
Good luck and enjoy,
Will
Good luck and enjoy,
Will