Yikes! Thanks for the warning. Seems strange that Roon would offer this add-on in their software and their own server (Roon Nucleus +) would not be able to handle it.
Ken
On the future of Roon...
- Thread starter nicoff
- Start date
Yikes! Thanks for the warning. Seems strange that Roon would offer this add-on in their software and their own server (Roon Nucleus +) would not be able to handle it.
Ken
2fastdriving
New member
I tried HQPlayer integration with roon once and found it klunky and not very reliable. Would love to know if people are really using this, trouble free. And how.
Of course at the time, I was running a sotm neo bridge and using its HQPlayer integration. Maybe that was the unreliable part.
Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
Of course at the time, I was running a sotm neo bridge and using its HQPlayer integration. Maybe that was the unreliable part.
Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
the nucleus is a dedicated device running roon ROCK, a lite version of their operating system implemented in LINUX. unless i am mistaken, it is not possible to run anything other that roon server on that configuration.
from roon: "The Nucleus runs Roon OS as an operating system and Roon OS only runs Roon Server."
thus you still need another (powerful) device/computer to install hqPlayer. that device then becomes a roon endpoint to which the nucleus sends the audio data for hqPlayer to process and then send along to the DAC
2fastdriving
New member
Agreed. Does anyone know how HQPlayer can use a roon endpoint (network dac) to send the music to? I'm not sure if my dac (esoteric n01xd) would support this.
Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
- Thread Author
- #25
Inside Roon settings, you will see an option to enable HQPlayer.
Then when using Roon, you will see HQPlayer as an available endpoint.
I do not think that HQP supports Esoteric directly.
However, there are ways to do so. Like sending the processed signal from HQP to a device that has a HQP NAA and then sending the digital data to any type of DAC. (One of my DACs is a Bryston and I can send music processed by HQP to the Bryston DAC that way using either optical cable or USB).
- Thread Author
- #26
I am running Roon/HQP together with zero issues.
My set up consists of PC running Windows 10. I bought a computer built for gaming (Falcon Northwest) with fast processors just for this purpose. Both Roon Core and HQP are installed in this machine. I have. t+a DAC that connects to the computer via USB. HQP takes any music and converts it to 512DSD on the fly. It works flawlessly every time.
I can also connect HQP to an inexpensive Raspberry Pi computer with built in HQP NAA. This allows me to use any DAC.
- Thread Author
- #27
I am using a Windows PC. Using Windows 10 you could upsample everything to DSD512 when using the right computer and DAC if you want to. Mac and Linux are limited to 256DSD if not mistaken (something to do with the operating system).
That said, I have been running HQP inside the PC but using HQP NAA that resides in a lowly Raspberry Pi (Linux) to send the data to the DAC and the result is fantastic.
Not familiar with Taiko or LinQ.
Alkyogre
New member
HQPlayer on Linux (tested on Ubuntu Studio) has DSD512 output.
I love Linux systems, they are really stable, temperature control better, pc is more quiet, not many side programs running all the time, you can set the power management by simply pushing the on/off button and it will never ever start with half an hour updating when booting.
about the future of Roon: I am a bit concerned about the future of Tidal/Qobuz.Without these services Roon is over.
the DSD rate is related to the DAC and whether or not it can accept a native DSD signal or whether DoP (DSD over PCM) is required.
in the case of t+a, there is a driver for windows which allows a native DSD signal to be sent to the DAC.
however, for mac and linux only a DoP signal can be sent to the DAC. unfortunately, this can only be done at 1/4 the maximum native DSD rate. for example, my t+a dac can accept DSD512 natively ...but, only DSD128 when send using DoP
this has to do with the USB receiver firmware used by t+a.
_________________________________________________
note: there is a USB receiver firmware update available which allows for native DSD streams from linux. i installed this update and can now send DSD512 natively to my DAC from a linux server (running roon ROCK). however, this is an advance user update that i can only recommend for those with good computer / software skills.
Alkyogre
New member
Getting confused. Why is my SMSL dac showing an input signal of 512 DSD on the display while using HQPlayer/Roon on Linux with DOP?
Is there something wrong with the T+A dac or is my SMSL showing 512 and reducing it inside to 1/4th.
Is there something wrong with the T+A dac or is my SMSL showing 512 and reducing it inside to 1/4th.
- Thread Author
- #31
In my case the issue is with the way my T+A DAC interacts with Linux but not Linux itself. I have confirmed that there is beta firmware for the T+A that would allow 512DSD via Linux. Given that the firmware upgrade is still in beta (and non-reversible) I am not willing to try it.
I also own a Roon Nucleus +. I have no idea why I would need to add extra computer processing power to convert to DSD 512 or DSD 256. It has been my experience through the entire history of all systems I have owned that native sampling in the native format, be it PCM or DSD, always sounds better than upsampling or converting to another format. It sounds to me like this is a case of a more complicated solution looking for a problem.
Ken
Swisstrips
Member
The main purpose and what put HQP on the map (generally speaking) are its filters and modulators when used for upsampling PCM > DSD. 256 is a sweat spot for many while to others 512 + 1024 is their preference. Obviously this will be DAC dependent, actually hugely dependent and almost always suites DACs that are or have NOS capability so as to let the audio PC and HQP do their thing (upsample with HQP) instead of the the internal DAC do the upsampling (which many chip based DACs do automatically and if they are not NOS then that internal upsampling cannot be "turned off")
Once you get into the higher sampling rates along with the combination of HQP filters and the new EC modulators, you NEED a high quality and powerful PC for the upsampling part. Nuculus and the like are not designed for this stage. Thus, this is where many take it from basic to stratosphere on an audio PC with dedicated LPS for CPU, drives, high quality eth and USB cards all of which are "usually" of a overall fan-less design and go DAC direct.
Another option (what I currently do) is to run roon core/server on a dedicated computer (win10, mac mini, Linux). I built up a current spec (i7-9700) small form factor computer running Ubuntu and does one thing only = roon server/core. Then i have a high end PC running Win Server 2019 and that runs HQP only (these two computers reside in util room). That powerful wkst then sends the upsampled HQP output to a HQP NAA endpoint (opticalRendu). There are many types of NAA's from a basic Pi to a Aqua LinQ. The endpoint is attached to a DAC.
So you can go DAC direct (roon + HQP on same computer with a high qulaity USB card) or the use of an endpoint to DAC.
There are a lot of permutations to the above and this is just some general "concepts". Are these plug n play, sorta depends. Some of these are pretty easy and just work while others are pretty intense and require solid computer and networking knowledge. Options I guess is the key word here. If one wants nothing to do with all this futzing (albeit control), one can keep it very simple (in the roon context) or opt for the aurender, lumin types with wonderful results
Just so I understand. In order to improve the sound of Roon, you install and configure HQP on another computer. Then, in HQP, you set it to upsample everything, even PCM red book to DSD 256/512 using a ASDM7EC modulator with a poly-sinc-ext2 filter.
The concern I have is that some DAC’s are optimized for native, so choosing the right DAC for this configuration and the right powerful PC is key. So all LINQ is doing is essentially being that NAA at the end of the day. So, if I understand correctly, unless you want to connect your DAC directly to the new powerful PC running HQP, you need an NAA, such as Antipodes or LINQ.
So in my case, I could run HQP on the Taiko Extreme with Roon, connect the LINQ to the Taiko and then connect the LINQ to the MSB?
Have most of you found this significantly increased the sound quality of Roon at the end of the day?
The concern I have is that some DAC’s are optimized for native, so choosing the right DAC for this configuration and the right powerful PC is key. So all LINQ is doing is essentially being that NAA at the end of the day. So, if I understand correctly, unless you want to connect your DAC directly to the new powerful PC running HQP, you need an NAA, such as Antipodes or LINQ.
So in my case, I could run HQP on the Taiko Extreme with Roon, connect the LINQ to the Taiko and then connect the LINQ to the MSB?
Have most of you found this significantly increased the sound quality of Roon at the end of the day?
MDP
Behavior Moderator (be nice police!)
Wow, Am I the only one confused by all this?
And they say vinyl is a hassle........I'll just lower the tonearm and call it good.
And they say vinyl is a hassle........I'll just lower the tonearm and call it good.
- Thread Author
- #38
You do not need a "gaming" PC. But you need a powerful computer and having a very good video card helps. It turns out that "gaming" computers are built with both. The processing power of video card is used by HQP to handle some of the processing. I only run Roon and HQPlayer in my PC. So I am using it as a dedicated audio component in my system.
gadawg
Member
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2017
- Messages
- 188
I've tried Roon ... love the features but the sound just isn't there for me even compared to my entry level Aurender or even a MBP running Audirvana that I use as the front end for my headphone listening. I think all the confusion on this thread is reason enough why Roon will likely never become more than a niche player and unless gain support by Apple or Spotify seem to have a limited runway. That said .. I hope I'm wrong as I certainly want there to be more choice not less in our audiophile community.
George
George
- Thread Author
- #40
I am running BOTH Roon and HQP on the same computer. The processing power varies depending on what you want HQP to do.
For example, the combination of converting everything to 512DSD, using full-blown poly-sinc filters (unlike the -2s filters), and on top adding DSP (I use room correction filters) require a VERY powerful computer with a video card (HQP can use the processing power of the card). But not everybody needs that.
If you keep the files in their native format and only do fixed multiple up-conversions (like PCM to 8xPCM; and DSD to 8xDSD), the processing power needs comes down considerably. Currently, this is what I am doing (plus filters and room correction DSP).
My current configuration is: One main computer running Roon/HQP. This is the computer that does all the number crunching. I have another very small computer (a $50 Raspberry Pi) with HQP NAA software installed. My main computer and the RPi are connected to the same network using an ethernet switch and ethernet cables. I connect the Rpi to two separate DACs (one via USB and the other via fiber connection).
I am not familiar with LinQ, but looking at HQP website, they list the Aqua LinQ as having a built-in NAA. To me that means that you might be already on third base. See if you can do the following:
- Connect the LinQ and the computer running Roon/HQP to the same network (this is as simple as connecting both to your internet switch with ethernet cables). On the computer running HQPlayer, open the app and go to HQP Settings. Under "Output Device Settings" in the "Backend" section you should now see "NetworkAudioAdapter" as an option. Choose that. Then under "Device" the LinQ should now show. Select the LinQ. Then save those changes.
- Connect LinQ to any DAC and make sure that in the LinQ you select the input to be the NAA.
- In Roon, choose HQP as your Roon Endpoint and press play and see how it goes.
- Connect LinQ to any DAC and make sure that in the LinQ you select the input to be the NAA.
- In Roon, choose HQP as your Roon Endpoint and press play and see how it goes.
I used to listen to Roon with my Squeezeboxes, but that was years ago. After I started playing around with HQP, I have been using Roon/HQP almost exclusively. Today, I don't think that I would be able to make a fair comparison.