Who cares.......

sharkmouth

sharkmouth

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I have owned one of the better digital systems, I have also had some very good gear/speakers/amps/preamps/dacs/cables etc. i guess I've been pretty fortunate when i think back on my audio life & who I have met & how they have helped me. My question is, how good do you think you're system is? I've heard someones description of said product & to me it's?Being honest now, here lies the question. I have had enough top shelf gear to know, someones lying!!!!!! Don't believe me? At the mo I have Magnepan 20.7's, feeding them from a very truthful preamp that is slightly one shade blue from white is the revered Sanders Magtech monos that are renowned for impregnating no signature. hence, why do some of my redbook cd's sound better than hi-res & why oh why do some audiophiles pressings leave me wanting. Seriously, why? I hear hi-res of the original analogue, most of the time it doesn't work for me. I hear the assorted or prestige recordings of recommendations from "the" socialites, leaves me very non "subscribed". The big question is , why is it so hard to find a sound that we are all wanting, remember here though, technology etc....., but, ? We are a victim of our own want, but, why hasn't our want developed a niche for what we need as in every other industry. We need the good sound & after spending close to half a million dollars on components, well.....
How honest are you? does you're system sound acceptable all the time? by the way, if you're thinking of an upgrade thats "no"
 
sharkmouth said:
I have owned one of the better digital systems, I have also had some very good gear/speakers/amps/preamps/dacs/cables etc. i guess I've been pretty fortunate when i think back on my audio life & who I have met & how they have helped me. My question is, how good do you think you're system is? I've heard someones description of said product & to me it's. Being honest now, here lies the question. I have had enough top shelf gear to know, someones lying!!!!!! Don't believe me? At the mo I have Magnepan 20.7's, feeding them from a very truthful preamp that is slightly one shade blue from white is the revered Sanders Magtech monos that are renowned for impregnating no signature. hence, why do some of my redbook cd's sound better than hi-res & why oh why do some audiophiles pressings leave me wanting. Seriously, why? I hear hi-res of the original analogue, most of the time it doesn't work for me. I hear the assorted or prestige recordings of recommendations from "the" socialites, leaves me very non "subscribed". The big question is , why is it so hard to find a sound that we are all wanting, remember here though, technology etc....., but, ? We are a victim of our own want, but, why hasn't our want developed a niche for what we need as in every other industry. We need the good sound & after spending close to half a million dollars on components, well.....
How honest are you? does you're system sound acceptable all the time? by the way, if you're thinking of an upgrade thats "no"
Click to expand...

Probably the room is often the biggest problem in the system and not using speakers that will sonically fill the room and room treatments.

The reason some redbook cd's sound better than hi-rez is because the hi-rez isn't what makes it sound better. A better recording and mastering can make it better. When you pay $30-60 for an SACD, the sellers know it better sound better than the redbook version, so it is recorded and/or remastered by someone who knows what they are doing, and that is what often makes it better. Unfortunately, they don't always sound better than the redbook disks.

We also become accustomed to what our system sounds like, sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. 95% of the "break-in" or "burn-in" period is nothing more than the owner getting used to what his system sounds like.

The biggest curse of a great system is you realize how terrible many recordings are that you used to enjoy listening to. A "forgiving" system that makes everything sound good isn't giving you what's on the recording.

I do not have any present plans to upgrade.
 
Kev, I've read this a few times and not sure I follow. Are you saying that certain recordings leave you unattached to the music, while some Redbooks sound better? Are you saying you have this great transparent system, but are not engaged in the music? Sorry...not sure I entirely follow....but let me see if I can add something....

As I walked around the shows this year, it became clear to me that there are two types of systems.....one that produces Audiophile Sound and one that produces Music. Often, the one that creates Audiophile Sound gets the most press and costs the most amount of money. Ultimately, it ends up being a left brain vs right brain fight. Usually the left brain wins out IF we are not being honest with ourselves. "This costs more. This measures better. This has better parts. This has newer technology. This has better reviews, so it must be better." Well, not necessarily.

My late Father used to smile at my audiophile journeys. He's been through them. He would simply say "enjoy the journey, but you're going to end up with tubes and horns because that's music." Damn I miss him.

But I digress. As for recordings, Redbook can sound better than high res. It's all in how it was recorded. Most of my reference recordings for testing gear is Redbook, not high res.

I'm not sure I've answered your question, but being honest with yourself is the first step in moving to the side of music.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
Mike said:
Kev, I've read this a few times and not sure I follow.
Click to expand...

+1.

I think it's a two part question.

To the first part about gear my response is this: I don't care how much money someones spent, how much gear they've heard and who they've rubbed elbows with in the industry, it doesn't mean they know and enjoy their music any more than someone with an AM radio. It's too subjective a subject.

As far as recording music, I think there are places that are committed to good sounding recordings. These places just don't have the funding to expand their horizons into all genres out there. Where would you start? Do you work on putting out quality recordings of past music? What type? Classical, Jazz, Rock, Country and Western, etc... or do you focus on new music that's just being made today? Most people put in a CD or plug an MP3 player into their car stereo, or their pocket, and that's good enough for them. It's such a broad field I think we should be lucky with what we have available to us already. Would I like every piece of music I buy to have the best sound quality possible, of course but until then I'll make due with what's out there.

Kev, maybe your system is so resolving and accurate it's not letting you enjoy most of your music. And as I jokingly say this it's also something to take into consideration.
 
dlb2 said:
+1.


Kev, maybe your system is so resolving and accurate it's not letting you enjoy most of your music. And as I jokingly say this it's also something to take into consideration.
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lmao!!! maybe its all them stillpoints in his sig. :roflmao:
 
Guys - I think he loves his system....but....well, ah, who the hell knows.....
 
Who cares . We all love you Kev ~! :dancing::flowers:

I love I mean I really love this audio journey. I'm not wealthy as some other people so I wouldn't build millionaire system.
However I enjoying the system I have and that's all that matter. Some guys marrying with most beautiful woman in the world and you see them still cheating their wife with ugly(?) woman. Why ? Coz each of them have their own pros and cons(?) I think it goes to our audio as well and hence me to owning two system ( SS and Tube ) in my main audio room and I'm really enjoying both of them.

So Kev whatever your point was let's just enjoy it. !
 
Am I the only one who read Kev's post thinking perhaps it was written after a night of particularly heavy drinking?
 
I've run it through my Australian to American translator machine....it came out all jumbled....looking like giant shrimp. :)
 
Mike said:
Kev, I've read this a few times and not sure I follow. Are you saying that certain recordings leave you unattached to the music, while some Redbooks sound better? Are you saying you have this great transparent system, but are not engaged in the music? Sorry...not sure I entirely follow....but let me see if I can add something....

As I walked around the shows this year, it became clear to me that there are two types of systems.....one that produces Audiophile Sound and one that produces Music. Often, the one that creates Audiophile Sound gets the most press and costs the most amount of money. Ultimately, it ends up being a left brain vs right brain fight. Usually the left brain wins out IF we are not being honest with ourselves. "This costs more. This measures better. This has better parts. This has newer technology. This has better reviews, so it must be better." Well, not necessarily.

My late Father used to smile at my audiophile journeys. He's been through them. He would simply say "enjoy the journey, but you're going to end up with tubes and horns because that's music." Damn I miss him.

But I digress. As for recordings, Redbook can sound better than high res. It's all in how it was recorded. Most of my reference recordings for testing gear is Redbook, not high res.

I'm not sure I've answered your question, but being honest with yourself is the first step in moving to the side of music.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...


Mike you hit the nail on the head! I also agree with your father. Tubes are the way to go. Tubes may add something to the music but it is very pleasing and satisfying. I tried to go all SS with my Pass amp and Pass preamp. The music was great, detailed, transparent but some music just sounded ok. When I went back to tubes with my BAT preamp, it made all my music more enjoyable, even the poorly recorded Cd's. Is it the most accurate sound, probably not, but what is accurate in the hifi world. No system sounds like a live performance. Yes, we can get some parts to sound live, like vocals in my system. But since when is live music transparent or airy? In home audio we tend to assign attributes to a system that pleases us individually. I have several systems in my home, some cheap like my Monitor Audio S1 speakers with a $100 Dayton Audio DTA-100a digital amp (Which sounds awesome with a cheap Chinese Maverick Audio tube DAC) to my reference system. I would have to say that all my systems share some similar attributes to the sound that pleases me and all have tubes somewhere in the system.

I think that part of the problem with audiophiles or enthusiasts are that we care constantly critiquing the sound without just sitting back and listening to music. I went through this period and I was unhappy. I finally got past this.
 
Mechnutt said:
Mike you hit the nail on the head! I also agree with your father. Tubes are the way to go. Tubes may add something to the music but it is very pleasing and satisfying. I tried to go all SS with my Pass amp and Pass preamp. The music was great, detailed, transparent but some music just sounded ok. When I went back to tubes with my BAT preamp, it made all my music more enjoyable, even the poorly recorded Cd's. Is it the most accurate sound, probably not, but what is accurate in the hifi world. No system sounds like a live performance. Yes, we can get some parts to sound live, like vocals in my system. But since when is live music transparent or airy? In home audio we tend to assign attributes to a system that pleases us individually. I have several systems in my home, some cheap like my Monitor Audio S1 speakers with a $100 Dayton Audio DTA-100a digital amp (Which sounds awesome with a cheap Chinese Maverick Audio tube DAC) to my reference system. I would have to say that all my systems share some similar attributes to the sound that pleases me.

I think that part of the problem with audiophiles or enthusiasts are that we care constantly critiquing the sound without just sitting back and listening to music. I when through this period and I was unhappy. I finally got past this.
Click to expand...

That's great to hear. You raise an excellent point with live music. I sometimes listen to these new SS amps (and some tube amps - like VTL) and I reference playing sax and what it sounded like up on stage, in practice, etc. A lot of these products make the music seem "over mic'd", and the engineers may argue, over mixed.
 
GaryProtein said:
We also become accustomed to what our system sounds like, sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. 95% of the "break-in" or "burn-in" period is nothing more than the owner getting used to what his system sounds like.

The biggest curse of a great system is you realize how terrible many recordings are that you used to enjoy listening to. A "forgiving" system that makes everything sound good isn't giving you what's on the recording.

I do not have any present plans to upgrade.
Click to expand...

I wholeheartedly agree with Gary's comment, burn in is partly our ears and brain getting used to a new component and the most revealing system is not necessarily the best considering the often pity full recording and mastering that takes place out there (rock and the "Loudness War" come to mind here). That's were you need to balance your system in such a way as to enjoy the music and nothing else. We often lose focus on what we are trying to achieve, listen to music.
 
It's a choice to listen to gear or music. I always say I'd rather listen to music than gear. I got into the listening to gear rut for a time (comparatively short to most others) and just got to the point where listening to my system was like going to a job you hate. That's when I knew I was in trouble and needed to turn it around. So I laid off even turning my system on for a couple of weeks and then decided if I wanted to listen to a CD or vinyl record or what have you and choose something, sat down and just listened while ignoring the gear completely. That renewed things for me.
That said, if there is an issue like the elephant in the room, then one needs to address that of course and fix it. If it's the room, that's a whole other downer to deal with. Then there is the quality of the recording. The important thing is choosing to just enjoy the music or futz with the gear all day pursuing unattainable results. Given the choice of having a musical system or a completely transparent system, I'd choose musical. Now ultimately I'd like a musical and "revealing" system which I think I have fairly close with my current system A. It's not transparent per se', it's just a bit revealing which is good for me because my ultimate goal was more detail in the music and that is what I hear now with the upgrades of the speakers and CD player (made a world of difference even in my horrifying room).
What do I think of my systems? System A = It's ok, even with my present receiver to a degree. The room is the really bad part and there is nothing I can do about it except move. So to that end I do the best I can with what I have and will be replacing the receiver to provide a little better room correction software and a few added abilities. Other than that, it's good for me, to someone else it may be total junk, but that doesn't matter. System B = My vintage system, it's fantastic in my opinion.
 
Bobvin said:
Am I the only one who read Kev's post thinking perhaps it was written after a night of particularly heavy drinking?
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LMAO !!

Bob, thats exactly what I thought when I read it this morning, I was going to ask Kev what he was smoking !!!!
 
I also I agree with Mike's Dad.

Having owned a Magtech amp, I think Kev should try a tube preamp.
 
Well some people want ultimate transparency, but then not every recording will sound good. They own and play only their favorite show pieces and revel in the glory of the sound, which is likely very good. But if the source isn't perfect it likely doesn't sound very good.

Then there's peopl elike me, who love all types of music and continually play and look for new things, not all of which is of "audiophile" quality. I still want it to sound decent and be musically enjoyable. If that means a trade off in not getting the ultimate sound experience on relatively few audiophile quality disks then so be it. Those still sound amazing anyway, but they are not what I listen to 95% of the time.
 
Bobvin said:
Am I the only one who read Kev's post thinking perhaps it was written after a night of particularly heavy drinking?
Click to expand...

MDP said:
LMAO !!

Bob, thats exactly what I thought when I read it this morning, I was going to ask Kev what he was smoking !!!!
Click to expand...


An altered state of mind is a prerequisite for most time on the net I thought. Do you guys do this sober? :snicker:
 
BlueMcIntosh said:
Some guys marrying with most beautiful woman in the world and you see them still cheating their wife with ugly(?) woman. Why ? Coz each of them have their own pros and cons(?) !
Click to expand...

Paul, something you need to share? Or is it with your wife you need to share. Then again Who Cares. ... ;)
 
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