Is there a characteristic McIntosh sound?

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bluegrassphile

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I've only auditioned one McIntosh integrated amp about a year ago so I'm a long way from being knowledgeable about their amps. My aural memory of the amp is very faded. I would think with as many models that McIntosh produces they would mostly not have a particular sonic personality, but a large variety of sonic personalities. So, is their a characteristic McIntosh sound?
 
bluegrassphile said:
I've only auditioned one McIntosh integrated amp about a year ago so I'm a long way from being knowledgeable about their amps. My aural memory of the amp is very faded. I would think with as many models that McIntosh produces they would mostly not have a particular sonic personality, but a large variety of sonic personalities. So, is their a characteristic McIntosh sound?
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Warm, and rolled off highs. Don't worry they don't have the resolution and clarity of your INT-250.

But, its a big bold sound; which many like.

I've heard their the latest (611 Monos +C53+) Diamond D3 ; Granted it was at Magnolia.

But, for that price; those speakers are capable of so much more.

IMHO; Mcintosh has their fans but, IMHO its more of a lifestyle brand now then a high end performance brand.

Audio Research is the High End brand of that group. Granted they are using tubes but, still what Mcintosh is charging.

I remember getting into the hobby a few years and wanting Mcintosh electronics. Heard them at Magnolia with at that time latest; previous gen Diamonds (Yellow Tweeter); 601 mono and C52 pre amp plus their CD cd player.

Wow; I was blown away.

Later in the day; Heard Kef Blades with Parasound front end; not even the monos.

Very different and drastic IMHO. Less expensive Electronics; KEF+Parasound had resolution, imaging, realism to the sound.

Mcintosh was muffled compared to them.
 
I owned several Mc pieces back in the day and managed a store that was a dealer. I also grew up in the shadow of the factory. In my view McIntosh has always been very good equipment that is quite over priced. They have a huge fan base and one of the best resale value of any gear out there.

Back then I like McIntosh but always felt there was other gear that sounded better for less money. I feel they definitely have a sound, the McIntosh sound. Warm, sort of laid back, rich and inviting. I also always felt they were not as dynamic and detailed. But McIntosh has a lot going for it.

Being a Binghamton boy I many times get Mc on the brain. Every time I start to seriously consider do I really want to switch to their gear I start considering that what I currently own will probably sound some what better, to me. Lately I have been thinking about possibly moving into one of their integrated amps, simplifying my system. Selling off some pieces to add toward the McIntosh cost. I know I would love having another Mc in the rack to go along with my tuner, but I also do not believe they offer a pre-amp either separate or in an integrated that sounds as good as my somewhat ugly Stage 2 :). I also know they do not offer a DAC that comes close to my T+A for my use in my view.

Being that I always have Mc on the brain I may eventual go in that direction anyways :).
 
In my humble opinion, absolutely they do. But so do many other brands, Pass or ARC for example. Even my Levinson for the most part.

That's why I like same brand pre & power, for synergy.

I've not owned Mac, my taste goes a different direction but I have always enjoyed it when I've listened to it. Some of the tube preamps I have found to be some rolled off but not all and their newer preamp I heard a couple years ago at Axpona was quite good. Their kilowatt monoblocks drove the flagship Nautilus like I've never heard before.

Mac is just easy, like Sunday morning. Like your favorite jeans, not best for all occasions but feel good when you wear them. :)

As far as I know they are very reliable and most well built products do cost.
 
Mr Peabody said:
In my humble opinion, absolutely they do. But so do many other brands, Pass or ARC for example. Even my Levinson for the most part.

That's why I like same brand pre & power, for synergy.

I've not owned Mac, my taste goes a different direction but I have always enjoyed it when I've listened to it. Some of the tube preamps I have found to be some rolled off but not all and their newer preamp I heard a couple years ago at Axpona was quite good. Their kilowatt monoblocks drove the flagship Nautilus like I've never heard before.

Mac is just easy, like Sunday morning. Like your favorite jeans, not best for all occasions but feel good when you wear them. :)

As far as I know they are very reliable and most well built products do cost.
Click to expand...

Summed up nicely


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
To properly qualify the answer to this question, it’s very important to determine whether we are talking about the pre-2018 McIntosh sound or post 2018 McIntosh sound. They are so fundamentally different that old Mc fans may enter a state of shock and old Mc haters may become fans.

The point here is that the Mc house sound has changed quite dramatically.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Mike said:
To properly qualify the answer to this question, it’s very important to determine whether we are talking about the pre-2018 McIntosh sound or post 2018 McIntosh sound. They are so fundamentally different that old Mc fans may enter a state of shock and old Mc haters may become fans.

The point here is that the Mc house sound has changed quite dramatically.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Would you say that the post 2018 sound is higher resolving? Aka more detail etc..

I did hear the new C53, 611 monos and with the latest Diamonds..

BUT.... they were streaming via Bluesound into the USB In on the Pre -amps built in Dac.

Sound was very hard sound; smooth but, no treble resolution; no mids.

As they say if its not captured at the source..
 
How has the sound changed after 2018? All McIntosh I have listened to were prior to 2018.
 
Hehe, I did :P. He didn't specifically say the "new" sound versus the "old" sound. He said he has tried a few different Mc's and liked the certain models, sometimes lower models, better. He also said that there is a very good chance that my Stage 2 and T+A are better sounding (again in a much more diplomatic way). He always has a way of getting my head out of the cloud when my Binghamton Boy McIntosh on the brain starts taking over :).... He is very good at getting me thinking clear again.

Thank you Mr. Joe!
 
Randy Myers said:
Hehe, I did :P. He didn't specifically say the "new" sound versus the "old" sound. He said he has tried a few different Mc's and liked the certain models, sometimes lower models, better. He also said that there is a very good chance that my Stage 2 and T+A are better sounding (again in a much more diplomatic way). He always has a way of getting my head out of the cloud when my Binghamton Boy McIntosh on the brain starts taking over :).... He is very good at getting me thinking clear again.

Thank you Mr. Joe!
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Oh yes indeed. You should hear our conversations! We like the same type of sound.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Right, why anyone would display a system like that with Bluesound is beyond me. It's good in it's range but not what I'd use for a higher quality system. The sound improvement even between a NAD streamer using Bluesound and my ACS10 was so far more than the price difference I am still amazed. That's just using the digital stream.

Anyone who will listen and cares there is a definite difference in the sound quality of streamers. I had to find out the hard way. $4k and I had such buyer remorse, dumping that and another nearly $2k has me in hi fi bliss.Again, the $2k brought such an incredible improvement, the best money I may have ever spent on my system.

mdp632 said:
Would you say that the post 2018 sound is higher resolving? Aka more detail etc..

I did hear the new C53, 611 monos and with the latest Diamonds..

BUT.... they were streaming via Bluesound into the USB In on the Pre -amps built in Dac.

Sound was very hard sound; smooth but, no treble resolution; no mids.

As they say if its not captured at the source..
Click to expand...
 
:wave:

Always here to help.

I love certain models, but not everything. The same is true for many other brands.


Randy Myers said:
Hehe, I did :P. He didn't specifically say the "new" sound versus the "old" sound. He said he has tried a few different Mc's and liked the certain models, sometimes lower models, better. He also said that there is a very good chance that my Stage 2 and T+A are better sounding (again in a much more diplomatic way). He always has a way of getting my head out of the cloud when my Binghamton Boy McIntosh on the brain starts taking over :).... He is very good at getting me thinking clear again.

Thank you Mr. Joe!
Click to expand...
 
mdp632 said:
Warm, and rolled off highs. Don't worry they don't have the resolution and clarity of your INT-250.

But, its a big bold sound; which many like.

I've heard their the latest (611 Monos +C53+) Diamond D3 ; Granted it was at Magnolia.

But, for that price; those speakers are capable of so much more.

IMHO; Mcintosh has their fans but, IMHO its more of a lifestyle brand now then a high end performance brand.

Audio Research is the High End brand of that group. Granted they are using tubes but, still what Mcintosh is charging.

I remember getting into the hobby a few years and wanting Mcintosh electronics. Heard them at Magnolia with at that time latest; previous gen Diamonds (Yellow Tweeter); 601 mono and C52 pre amp plus their CD cd player.

Wow; I was blown away.

Later in the day; Heard Kef Blades with Parasound front end; not even the monos.

Very different and drastic IMHO. Less expensive Electronics; KEF+Parasound had resolution, imaging, realism to the sound.

Mcintosh was muffled compared to them.
Click to expand...

Always amused at people who make comments about McIntosh like the ones above. Rolled off highs, warm, less resolution, muffled, more lifestyle than high end performance. Auditioning McIntosh at Magnolia, streaming via Bluesound and thinking you actually heard a system at its best is revealing, then claiming the B&W speakers are capable of so much more, and Audio Research is the High End brand of that group. I have no issues with anyone's opinions, just their accuracy.

MC601 power amplifier:
Frequency Response +0, -0.25dB from 20Hz to 20,000Hz, +0, -3.0dB from 10Hz to 100,000Hz at full rated output. Where's the roll off, and where's the peak in the lower midrange that would demonstrate warmth. Total Harmonic Distortion: 0.005% maximum harmonic distortion at any power level from 250 milliwatts to rated power, 20Hz to 20,000Hz. This is typical for McIntosh power amplifier specifications across their catalog.

Come on now, lets get real. There are plenty of people who know McIntosh is really designed and marketed specifically to old men, doctors, and lawyers who have no clue what good sound is all about, and are only concerned with showing off cool lifestyle products in their fancy homes. That's why McIntosh puts so little effort into their amplifier designs. There's no point in wasting research and design dollars trying to be competitive in the marketplace when their customers can't hear a difference in the first place. I mean, it's common knowledge, right?

Does McIntosh have a house sound. Certainly, just like every other audio component manufacturer. Just like their competitors, McIntosh continuously tries to please the widest audience, making adjustments in their designs over time to remain current. Again, no different than Audio Research, Pass Labs, Bryston, Ayre and the rest. There is no such thing as a perfect power amplifier, one that introduces zero influence on the signal that passes through its circuits. Neutral is a fantasy in the ear of component owners. Every audio amplifier influences the sound in one way or another, just like preamplifiers, speakers, source components, cables, power conditioners, vibration control, and any number of other system contributions. You either like the final results or not. For some, bashing McIntosh is full time entertainment. The good thing about opinions is we all have them. That's what keeps our hobby interesting and fun.
 
jdandy said:
Always amused at people who make comments about McIntosh like the ones above. Rolled off highs, warm, less resolution, muffled, more lifestyle than high end performance. Auditioning McIntosh at Magnolia, streaming via Bluesound and thinking you actually heard a system at its best is revealing, then claiming the B&W speakers are capable of so much more, and Audio Research is the High End brand of that group. I have no issues with the anyone's opinions, just their accuracy.

MC601 power amplifier:
Frequency Response +0, -0.25dB from 20Hz to 20,000Hz, +0, -3.0dB from 10Hz to 100,000Hz at full rated output. Where's the roll off, and where's the peak in the lower midrange that would demonstrate warmth. Total Harmonic Distortion: 0.005% maximum harmonic distortion at any power level from 250 milliwatts to rated power, 20Hz to 20,000Hz. This is typical for McIntosh power amplifier specifications across their catalog.

Come on now, lets get real. There are plenty of people who know McIntosh is really designed and marketed specifically to old men, doctors, and lawyers who have no clue what good sound is all about, and are only concerned with showing off cool lifestyle products in their fancy homes. That's why McIntosh puts so little effort into their amplifier designs. There's no point in wasting research and design dollars trying to be competitive in the marketplace when their customers can't hear a difference in the first place. I mean, it's common knowledge, right?

Does McIntosh have a house sound. Certainly, just like every other audio component manufacturer. Just like their competitors, McIntosh continuously tries to please the widest audience, making adjustments in their designs over time to remain current. Again, no different than Audio Research, Pass Labs, Bryston, Ayre and the rest. There is no such thing as a perfect power amplifier, one that introduces zero influence on the signal that passes through its circuits. Neutral is a fantasy in the ear of component owners. Every audio amplifier influences the sound in one way or another, just like preamplifiers, speakers, source components, cables, power conditioners, vibration control, and any number of other system contributions. You either like the final results or not. For some, bashing McIntosh is full time entertainment. The good thing about opinions is we all have them. That's what keeps our hobby interesting and fun.
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Respectively and IMHO.

There are a lot better amplifiers, just not sold at dealers who are also Mcintosh dealers. When I mean better, I mean more resolving for the money than Mcintosh is charging.

Thats what the high end to me personally is about. To warrant some of of these prices.

If I wanted colored sound, I could spend a lot less than Mcintosh to have a fun warm system.

I've also heard those Diamonds with the following Electronics ; Chord Hugo TT2+MScaler+TTtoby (Stereo) , Audionet PRE G2+AMP Monos+Their CD Player ; Respectively , they both were a better match than Mcintosh with B&W.

Again, to what I'm subjectively looking for.

Pace, Rhythm, Timing, Speed, Resolution, Low Distortion.

My friend, I was just comparing it to what I heard using my own two ears. Now, yes Magnolia wasn't or isn't an ideal place to demo but, perhaps they should get the vendor there and think of a better way to showcase their products.

Their lowfi/mid-fi streaming setup doesn't suffice. Probably should have played a physical CD but, of course the market demands convenience so, quality suffers. Maybe McIntosh should develop their own streamer/roon endpoint and have it use their MCT connection.
 
mdp632 said:
If I wanted colored sound, I could spend a lot less than Mcintosh to have a fun warm system.
Click to expand...

mdp632.......Well good for you. There is a wide selection of great audio components available at remarkably reasonable price points. The fact is you are going to get colored sound no matter the component cost. Spend less than McIntosh or spend more, none of it is live sound, merely reproductions, facsimiles of the original event subject to all the foibles associated with every component part in the signal path from the microphones and consoles in recording studios to the sound system components and speakers we assemble for playback in our homes. There is only one real uncolored event. It's called live. Everything else is a highly subjective illusion. It is pleasing to know one can be thrifty and still manage to build a quality sound system that can be considered high-end. That's just one more aspect to our great hobby that keeps things enjoyable. There really is something for everyone.
 
I might also argue that most live is not really live either. Most live events are using microphones, amplifiers, speakers, sound boards, etc. Many times digital sound affects are added :)...

Therefore the only true "live" is listening in a setting where you are hearing the instrument, the vocals of the individual singing without the use of amplifiers, etc. This is a rare occurrence except for some classical music events, only from my understanding since I have not attended many orchestrated events. My wife and I recently attend an event where an amazing violinist played several Bach pieces. It was a very small event with only about 30 in attendance. You could really appreciate the tone of his violin!
 
jdandy said:
mdp632.......Well good for you. There is a wide selection of great audio components available at remarkably reasonable price points. The fact is you are going to get colored sound no matter the component cost. Spend less than McIntosh or spend more, none of it is live sound, merely reproductions, facsimiles of the original event subject to all the foibles associated with every component part in the signal path from the microphones and consoles in recording studios to the sound system components and speakers we assemble for playback in our homes. There is only one real uncolored event. It's called live. Everything else is a highly subjective illusion. It is pleasing to know one can be thrifty and still manage to build a quality sound system that can be considered high-end. That's just one more aspect to our great hobby that keeps things enjoyable. There really is something for everyone.
Click to expand...

We can agree to disagree :D

Let's put it this way in hobby. You can ask 100 people what amp,speaker,cable,etc.. they like.

You'll most likely get close to 100 different responses.

Since the hobby is so subjective ; their can never be an "Absolute Sound"

Since everyone definition of it is quite different.
 
It's great someone came in and is trying to rescue a great American brand from bankers who bought it just to sell it. Bahne Capital I believe. I've owned MANY Mc pieces before the rescue attempt. Problem after problem. Just check the thread here. My 252 has problems etc.I remember buying a MCD1000 or something. A$10,000 CD player and DAC. They released it knowing it had a malfunction . I had to ship it back to Binghamton NY , just to get it to operate properly. Madness. Shameful.What happened to the great WBT speaker terminals on the amps? Cost and quality cutting. I hope the new owners do a great job. $ for $, there are far better values to be had. I think the "lifestyle brand" comment is right on. It's the same people who are still buying Harley Davidsons and Corvettes. The new Corvette does look promising though ...
 
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