Hegel vs. Pass - thoughts?

J

Justin

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Since folks here were so friendly and helpful after my last (and first) post, I was hoping to get some feedback here on differences between Hegel and Pass.

I am a relatively new audiophile (2+ years). I have Rockport Atria speakers and a newly delivered Berkeley Reference DAC. I currently have Hegel H20 and P20.

My default plan has been to upgrade to Hegel H30 and search far and wide for the right preamp to add some "magic" to the sound. Based on feedback here from last post, I opened my preamp search to tube preamps to mate with H30. Have only heard one relatively inexpensive, little hyped tube preamp (Rogue RP5), and while that will not be the answer, it was revelatory: there was an organic flow and tone to the music with this little preamp that I had missed in the SS preamps I've tried with the H30. I will listen to Rogue Hera II and a handful of other tube preamps in the coming days.

But, before going this route, the 1 amp that consistently grabs my attention from what I've heard is Pass. Can anyone comment on the differences between Hegel H30 and Pass 60.8's, for instance? Are the 60.8's adequate to drive my 87.5 db Atrias?

I feel I am at an important decision point in system design: go H30 and then solve for the missing variable (likely a tube preamp) - or track down Pass gear (might need to have out of town ship from Reno Hi-fi) to try out.

Words that might describe qualities I'm drawn to in electronics: ease of power, musical, sweet midrange, emotional, non-fatiguing, bloom, electric, lush, immediate. I am definitely not looking for the final word in transparency, bass, or soundstage. I have learned the hard way that I could care less what Stereophile or any expert says. It has value but nothing replaces my own ears. I want to hear Jerry Garcia on guitar or Miles on trumpet and have the maximum emotional response. But I need enough power and bottom end for this groove-based music that - at times - is played with some decent volume.

In short, I think the H30 can be a great fit - while matched with a preamp that sprinkles some magic dust on the overall sound.

How would an all Pass system compare?

Any thoughts? Should I do the easier thing and buy an amp that I've heard several dozen times and know I like (H30) or deal with the inconvenience of tracking down Pass gear?

Thanks for your help - this is such a great forum.
 
Justin, I can't help you with a comparison between Pass and Hegel, I can only tell you, that for me, my Pass XA100.5 pushes all the right buttons. I use mine with 92dB efficient speakers and the Pass monoblocs are all I could ask for.
 
I wouldn't recommend 60.8's for 87db efficient speakers. 160.8 would be the ticket. But price wise vs the Hegel, that's many multiples.

I would focus on Hegel H30 with a killer tube preamp (VAC for example).

Mike
 
Mike said:
I wouldn't recommend 60.8's for 87db efficient speakers. 160.8 would be the ticket. But price wise vs the Hegel, that's many multiples.

I would focus on Hegel H30 with a killer tube preamp (VAC for example).

Mike
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I totally agree with Mike. Like I said before, you won't really appreciate the Hegel until you try a different pre. The Pass gear is very good stuff, but you will have to spend a lot more money to appreciate it vs the H30.
Brucelet on our forum pairs a Mc tube pre with his H30 and is in love with the sound. I plan on trying a tube pre also in my system to see if it's better than my Classe, so far the CP 800 hasn't been beat, but I try and stay open minded.

The ARC Ref 5SE was also very good when I paired it with the H30. But that was in a different system than mine.
 
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Will Justin, you spent a lot of money for your speakers & DAC. Why not spend a lot of money and purchase a pair of Pass xa160.8 and be done with it? That's what I would do! Keep it all the same pedigree.
 
I agree with George - if you can swing it....XA160.8's all day long. But price wise, we aren't comparing apples to apples.
 
I'd stick with the H30, and try different preamps, as it was your original impulse :) SS amp + tube preamp is a classic combination! Just looking now at Mike' sig, I'm reminded of the AirTight preamps... Those could be a good match!

The H30 is fantastic, and at its price, can't be beat.
 
Justin....what preamp/amp options do you have locally to listen to (either at dealer with your Atrias if possible or better yet at home)?
 
cmalak said:
Justin....what preamp/amp options do you have locally to listen to (either at dealer with your Atrias if possible or better yet at home)?
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Well, I live in Boston area. I have identified and plan on listening to the following pres: ARC Ref5SE, Ayre KX-R (not tube, but still would like to hear), Rogue Hera II, possibly a Jadis pre, VAC (not sure which model), Shindo Monbrison (but would likely be interested in Vosne Romanee-L).

for amps, I've heard everything that my dealer has to offer and nothing clicked as much as H30. played around with Devialet setup for a bit, but I found it to lack emotional response. really liked Constellation gear but when I came back to H30 I realized that I do very much enjoy the immediacy and character of H30.

This thread has already been hugely helpful for 1 major reason: feedback that the 60.8's won't give me as much juice as I'd want/need. In that event, maybe Pass gear is something I revisit down the road when $$ and time allow, but it seems to me make sense to focus on H30 and then solve for the missing variable: the best pre to squeeze all the character out of this system I can get. Considering there's really no local Pass dealer, this seems the right way to go.

Anyone ever hear Shindo with H30? I know most Shindo fans go all Shindo, but I'm curious.

Also curious: anyone ever hear Pass XP30 (or XP20) with H30 amp?

Thanks
Justin
 
Justin...I am in Boston too. Sounds like you're dealing with Paul at Goodwins (great guy) with regards to the Hegel stuff (and I am sure your Atrias). Goodwins is a bit light on tube stuff right now, so yes you can listen to Audio Research (they have a demo Ref5SE for sale), McIntosh and VTL at Natural Sounds in Framingham. Also, Shindo and Leben at Westford Audio. Finally, Fidelis in NH (1 he from Boston) has VAC, VTL, BAT, for tube stuff as well as Pass Labs, if you want to check them out. Lots of options.
 
Be sure to listen to a Soulution 520 preamp in your system, it "is" one of the better ones out there when one wants to go stratosphere pricing or top shelf!
 
You mention Ayre preamp I own that preamp and like it a lot. You also mention going to a tube preamp do as you like just do some reading on tubes they are more trouble in some cases than SS not saying you can not make it work just know what you are getting into.

Never used Pass gear so I am no help to you on that one.
 
Audioseduction said:
Will Justin, you spent a lot of money for your speakers & DAC. Why not spend a lot of money and purchase a pair of Pass xa160.8 and be done with it? That's what I would do! Keep it all the same pedigree.
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Can those familiar with the Pass sound attempt to describe the 160.8's - and how it might be a little different from H30? Also, would you go XP-30 as preamp with these?

Close to ordering H30, but curious how you'd all describe the 160.8 sound...
 
I heard the Atrias with the H30 and it was an excellent combo but I would stay away from the Hegel preamp with it. I love the Hegel with my McIntosh C500T. It was also nice with the Constellation preamp. If you are thinking Pass, you don't have to go far. Mike is a Pass dealer.
 
BruceLet said:
I heard the Atrias with the H30 and it was an excellent combo but I would stay away from the Hegel preamp with it. I love the Hegel with my McIntosh C500T. It was also nice with the Constellation preamp. If you are thinking Pass, you don't have to go far. Mike is a Pass dealer.
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Thanks, BruceLet. I will add the C500T to the list...
 
Update: pulled the trigger and ordered H30 yesterday. looking forward to playing around with preamp options and finding the rights match.
 
BruceLet said:
I heard the Atrias with the H30 and it was an excellent combo but I would stay away from the Hegel preamp with it. I love the Hegel with my McIntosh C500T. It was also nice with the Constellation preamp. If you are thinking Pass, you don't have to go far. Mike is a Pass dealer.
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I have a mint condition Pass XP-20 preamp, with a brand new Revelation Audio Labs CryoSilver Reference DB-25 Umbillical cable going up for sale shortly. Price will be 4k, plus shipping. At this price, I would think you could give it a thorough try-out.......and re-sell at no loss (if synergy is not found). You could pick up my Pass XS-150 monos as well, but it sounds like they may be above the budget you've set aside ?? Either way, good luck with your system.

Happy listening........Jerry-
 
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