Educate me please re: DSD files & DACs that'll play them.

Bobvin

Bobvin

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During my hiatus from the high-end, SACD came and (almost) went. Now I see a clamoring for DACs that will play DSD files. My question is how does one "rip" a DSD file from an SACD so that it can be sent to a DAC? Most computers don't see the DSD layer of a hybrid disc, or am I mistaken. Do you store DSD files in the same way you store a FLAC file? Do programs like JRiver deal with these files?
 
Bob - I am trying to track down a link to SACD ripping (stay tuned). It isn't for the faint of heart....but it can be done. You "rip" a SACD using a modded PS3 (Sony Playstation 3). The resulting file is a .DSF file type (not FLAC. FLAC is PCM). JRiver handles all file types - including DSF with ease.

Do you have a lot of SACD's? If not, you may want to steer clear and stick with high res PCM files from HDTracks.

I'm in the process of converting all my DSD files to FLAC (PCM) using KORG. I have tested a few files and have been really impressed. I have not done a serious A/B yet - but a first blush....I'm very impressed. The reason for doing this is so I can use my DSD files on my non-DSD compatible DACs.
 
Mike said:
Bob - I am trying to track down a link to SACD ripping (stay tuned). It isn't for the faint of heart....but it can be done. You "rip" a SACD using a modded PS3 (Sony Playstation 3). The resulting file is a .DSF file type (not FLAC. FLAC is PCM). JRiver handles all file types - including DSF with ease.

Do you have a lot of SACD's? If not, you may want to steer clear and stick with high res PCM files from HDTracks.

I'm in the process of converting all my DSD files to FLAC (PCM) using KORG. I have tested a few files and have been really impressed. I have not done a serious A/B yet - but a first blush....I'm very impressed. The reason for doing this is so I can use my DSD files on my non-DSD compatible DACs.
Click to expand...

don't mean to get off subject, but this is the best news I've heard all week... there might be hope then for doing DSD downloads, then converting to PCM for playback. Which, in effect is what I'm doing this very second listening to my very first DSD download.
 
Rayooo said:
don't mean to get off subject, but this is the best news I've heard all week... there might be hope then for doing DSD downloads, then converting to PCM for playback. Which, in effect is what I'm doing this very second listening to my very first DSD download.
Click to expand...

I'm using this program: AudioGate - Audio Format Conversion Application - | KORG

It's working like a charm (so far)! Just be advised....it's a little slow to convert files...but it does the best job that I have found. I've tried a few other programs and the KORG one is slow and steady and is definitely winning the DSD to FLAC race.

I then use JRiver for Mac to adjust my output all to 24/96 (the limitations of my DAC). So far....happy listening!
 
CREDIT: This is from Ted Brady

BIG THANK YOU TED for sharing with us at Audioshark.org

Here are my links to my guide and the tools.

First read the guide throughout.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3487125/SACD ripper primer v3.0.zip
p

Then download the firmware
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3487125/CFW355-OTHEROS++.zip

Then download the ripper and keys
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3487125/sacd-ripper.zip
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3487125/ps3free-ps3keys.zip

For Windows extraction:
Here is a simple primer (in case you don't already have a root folder and
Programs subfolder):

1) First make a new folder close to a root drive (so the naming path doesn't
get too long..sometimes the classical ones are ridiculous). Call it
anything, say, ISO2DSD.
2) Then make a subfolder in it called Programs (capital "P").
3) Put the SACD-extract.exe (first link below, unzip) executable in the
Programs subfolder.

https://code.google.com/p/sacd-ripper/downloads/detail?name=sacd_extract_0.37_WIN32.zip&can=2&q=

4) Put the bat files (link below, unzip) in the main folder. One is for
stereo extraction, one for multichannel

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3487125/Extract DST Stereo DSF Files.zip
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3487125/Extract DST DSF Multichannel Files.zip

5) So then put any number of ISOs (rename the ISOs if their name is too
long; something that will uniquely identify them but not too long) you want
to extract in the main folder (the one with the bat, the one we
hypothetically called ISO2DSD).
6) Click on the bat file of your choice, and voila..and then each ISO will
extract to DSF tracks, putting one album full of tracks in a folder each (20
ISOs, 20 new folders created). When you do this again (for more ISOs)
remove the already-extracted ISOs or they will get worked on again! Each
ISO can take 10 minutes or more (multichannel much longer), so once you have
this down well do a boatload overnight.
 
Mike, thanks for the nice words.

Could you fix the couple of links broken (to my guide, the extract google site link, and to the multichannel bat file)? Word wrap issues. They all need to be on one line each.

I have ripped thousands of SACDs and would be open to any questions, etc. Enjoy!
 
ted_b said:
Mike, thanks for the nice words.

Could you fix the couple of links broken (to my guide and to the multichannel bat file)? Word wrap issues. On the first one the "p" in zip is missing and on the next line, making the link broken. Same issue with my multichannel bat, except more characters on the secpnd line. I'd put them here but don't want to clutter this up.

I have ripped thousands of SACDs and would be open to any questions, etc. Enjoy!
Click to expand...

Done. Thanks again Ted (aka Mr. DSD!!)
 
Mike, the extractor (google project) and multichannel bat links are still word wrapped and broken.
 
Yes, I just linked to it easily. I can't post links cuz I'm a newbie here, but just go to E's link and then downloads, and choose Win extractor v3.7

Mike's link is still broken., He's missing at least an s in https.

Maybe I should post four more times so I can put up my stuff. :)
 
ted_b said:
Yes, I just linked to it easily. I can't post links cuz I'm a newbie here, but just go to E's link and then downloads, and choose Win extractor v3.7

Mike's link is still broken., He's missing at least an s in https.

Maybe I should post four more times so I can put up my stuff. :)
Click to expand...

Oh....I'll fix that Ted. Check in 10 minutes and you will have worldly powers....ok, you'll be able to post.
 
Guys, some misinformation earlier in this thread. Let me clarify:
* when you use an SACD-capable PS3 (there are only four models, and eadh is older than 2007) it needs to be at firmware/software level 3.55 or belwo. Simple software downrev hacks (from systems higher than 3.55) are not available. You would need to spend a $100 and have a PS3 repair shop do a hardware downgrade. The problem is that there are not a lot of these eligible PS3s and mostr Ebay sellers have no clue what system software elevl they are at, or lie about it.
* the ripper project (all necessary pieces in my links) then does not produce DSF or DFF fiels, it produces an ISO image of the SACD disc. THEN, one would want to extract DSF (there are two DSD formats, DSF and DFF. The only difference is that DSF can do tags and album art, so I use it 100% of the time. No downside). My little step by step primer I included in my email to Mike (which he is in the midst of cleaning up) then allows you to take multiple ISOs and extract them to DSF folders (folder full of individual tracks) in batch. Keep the ISOs for archiving, or for when you want to extract multichannel (assuming the disc has multichannel) content.
 
For stereo DSD playback there are now dozens of DSD-capable DACs. I help co-ordinate a DSD database, which can be found in Google Docs. (Note: I wish I could post links, I'd post a link to it :) ). Google it. Jesus (Sonore US) and I are very proud if it, and I've enlisted a good friend in the business, Grammy-nominated recoridng producer Cookie Marenco (BlueCoast Records, splendid DSD recordings available as downloads) to help co-ordinate and keep an eye out for new DSD stuff. :)
 
Audiogate is a decent tool to convert DSD to PCM (if you have to do it; it's a slightly to severely damaging conversion, but necessary for those without a DSD-capable DAC). However, I have grown to like JRiver's own on-the-fly conversion even more, and no need to keep two folders of the same music. Their algorithms are very sophisticated.
 
ted_b said:
Audiogate is a decent tool to convert DSD to PCM (if you have to do it; it's a slightly to severely damaging conversion, but necessary for those without a DSD-capable DAC). However, I have grown to like JRiver's own on-the-fly conversion even more, and no need to keep two folders of the same music. Their algorithms are very sophisticated.
Click to expand...

Yes - especially those with streamers like a Linn. Is there any way for JRiver to do the conversion and save it into a separate folder?
 
ted_b said:
Audiogate is a decent tool to convert DSD to PCM (if you have to do it; it's a slightly to severely damaging conversion, but necessary for those without a DSD-capable DAC). However, I have grown to like JRiver's own on-the-fly conversion even more, and no need to keep two folders of the same music. Their algorithms are very sophisticated.
Click to expand...

Good to hear this...as I was using JRiver on-the-fly today also. I did end up using J-River to do a conversion to FLAC, mainly just to see what a possible workflow might be.
 
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