Aside from Stillpoints, what else do you use for isolation
- Thread starter MikeCh
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Myles B. Astor
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Use both also, occasionally some Goldmund cones too.
highEndguy
New member
Maple
highEndguy
New member
Mapleshade cork/rubber footer
highEndguy
New member
Nordost Sort Kone
what are you using them for or looking to isolate??
i got a million diy ideas.lol. im not going to put $3000 speakers on $6000 worth of stillpoints.lol.
i love rubber to isolate shelves, i buy those iso blocks and cut em in 4 , and even though my rack has threads for points under each shelf, i prefer using the isoblocks in each corner. amp stands , 1 isoblock cut in 4 under each corner, 4 layrs of maple ply. then the amps on there factory rubber feet on stick on rubber pads 2 layers, in between those and the wood. my turntable is up on a shelf i made of 5 layers of 13/16" maple ply wrapped with 1x5 maple, then rubber pads between the top of my rack legs and the bottom of the shelf. i made the rack and top to have spikes also but never use them and the rubber is better and makes it sturdier.
do you have any wood skills?? cause there are alot of those really expensive platforms that can be made at home if you have some tools, knowledge and time. i always look and see how they make any that i see anywhere. if i paid for a really nice isloation platform, id probably take it apart and ruin it to see how its made.lol.
- Thread Author
- #9
I'm currently using a combination of isoblocks and a 18"x24"x3" maple slab under my turntable. Isoblocks under other components as well.
Mostly wondering if stepping into a different rack and/or individual component "feet" isolation is worth chasing.
My current rack has sand filled legs with spikes (in cups) and sits on a concrete slab. It's pretty well isolated from the environment as it is. However, like all things audio....there is likely a better solution but with an increase in price tag too.
the professor
Well-known member
I love SRA! They take a while to custom do a platform but well worth it. Always double the time they say. For example, they told me 3 weeks for my amp stands for my Cary amps and SO FAR it's been 7 weeks. 
Even still - they are worth it. Their pricing is between the Stilpoint SS and Ultra 5s. So not exactly cheap. But IMO they outperform Ultra 5s but as they are custom they don't have as much flexibility. I use them exclusively for amp stands.
Even still - they are worth it. Their pricing is between the Stilpoint SS and Ultra 5s. So not exactly cheap. But IMO they outperform Ultra 5s but as they are custom they don't have as much flexibility. I use them exclusively for amp stands.those feet on your classic are pretty good, i got them on my classic of course but before that i bought them separately for my scout and my aries. isolation for the jmw is very important though, as it is for any unipivot. i dont think you can do better with the wood slab on isoblocks unless your willing to spend some $$. as long as you dont get any rack or floor vibrations you should be fine. i think at one point i bought the floor sliders from home depot, the 3" ones and used them upsidedown under my classics feet. so the rubber was supporting the table and put stick on felt pads under the hard plastic part. believe it or not, it helped.lmao!!! my floor is not so sturdy. which is a big reason why i fell for the all rubber table. that really needs no isolation. good luck with whatever you decide.
any questions on cheap diy things you know where to find me.lol.
NorthStar
New member
Good thread. 
eace:
eace:Its taken a lot of systematic experimentation in my own system to get to the current level of isolation. I know exactly what tone I want the system to produce...its my primary #1 goal of all...and I find that isolation simply allows that tone to come thru clearer and stronger each time I isolate a component. But there are a lot of dead-ends and pitfalls I have found along the way...namely because every isolation material has its own pros/cons that affect the sound.
(Note: all my electronics are already in a custom rack: 4" thick birch ply sitting on top of 2" slab of slate.)
Here are my own conclusions to date:
1. Isolation Sandwiches work best for me. Basically isolation underneath and damping and often 'mass damping' on top.
2. Each material has slightly sound-related tendencies to either: adjust the tonal balance (typically when made purely of metal) or not to be quite as perfectly clear (pure elastomer only).
3. Mass Damping works extremely well...Adding pure weight on top of a component...but be careful.
When done right, mass damping helps to 'concentrate' the signal. Extraneous vibration are even more controlled/dampened. When its right, you will find a violin string crescendo at the very peak of the note suddenly takes on this INTENSE sweetness even as the note hits the high which normally 'screeches' just a teeny bit. The screech is not the string...its the miniscule vibration that then breaks up that last bit of note. (At least, that's my non-techie way of understanding it).
I actually discovered this when, by accident, I ended up with an extra Auralex platform and stuck it under my Gryphon Colosseum...greater depth (wow!) but lost tonal weight in keyboard. I placed an Artesania damping plate on top...it had helped smaller amps a lot...and it helped (a little). Randomly, I began pressing down on the top of the Gryphon...kinda thinking 'maybe more damping'...at first nothing. Then I kept pressing, and blam!...the strings hit a crescendo and there was this intense purity. I kept releasing and trying...and it kept coming back as soon as I hit that critical amount of pressure. I took a weight scale and placed it on top of the gryphon to understand how much weight I was applying. 20kg.
I have a mirror polished brass weight on top of the Artesania damping plate on top of the Gryphon now.
Now there are definitely some 'watch-outs' with mass damping.
a. Add a few pounds and you may hear absolutely no difference. I found on my components 20kg (45 pounds) makes the difference. Gryphon Colosseum and Tripoint Thor both have 20kg of solid brass on top. The Tripoint manufacturer actually supported my experiment when I told him my findings...I thought like many manufacturers he would deny it. Instead, he confirmed it should work and he does similar things, indicating that no matter how robust the casing, [properly] mass damping will add that extra bit of isolation that should work for the reasons above.
b. I CANNOT put the pure metal on top of any of my cabinets. I always have the brass on top of a well designed damper (Artesania, HRS). Otherwise, the sound hardens...its downright awful. very hard and unforgiving...deadens the decay of notes.
c. on the aesthetic side which for many of us matters...I use mirror polished brass scientific weights. I buy them second hand but in mint condition. I have 76lbs on top of the Velodyne, 45lbs on Gryphon, 45 pounds on Tripoint Thor
4. So what does an 'isolation sandwich' look like typically?
- Underneath: [HRS M3 with Nimbus Couplers] OR [Ultra 5s with HRS Nimbus on top of the Ultra 5s] OR [Ultra 5s on top of Auralex Isolation Platform]. As mentioned above, the Ultra 5s do alter the tonality just a touch in my system...just a teeny leaning out of the lower treble...piano loses weight and feels like electronic keyboard'ish. I read so many great reviews of Ultra 5...after buying them...I found 1 review (on the Stillpoints site!) noting this exact phenomena...and I am fortunate I have managed to fix it in my system because I love the Ultra 5s. Adding the Nimbus Couplers adds ALL that lower treble tonal weight back...but maintains ALL the clarity of the spectacularly clear, delineated Ultra 5
- On Top: HRS double-thickness Dampers, Artesania Dampers and sometimes Ultra 5...and sometimes mass damping too.
Again, I know exactly what tone I want the system to produce...its my primary #1 goal of all...and I find that isolation simply allows that tone to come thru clearer and stronger each time I isolate a component. But along the way to making the sandwich configuration, the tone will change...and it takes experimentation for each component's isolation sandwich to ensure the tone I want is maintained...while continuing to eliminate vibration, grunge, mechanical distortion...which again makes that tone sing thru even clearer, better and more beautifully/purely.
Nowadays, i can demonstrate to visitors that SLIDING AN ULTRA 5 across the top of one component makes a difference. It has become that sensitive to alterations in vibration. The Ultra 5 Distributor who came to visit was extremely surprised.
Conclusion
Every single component in my system is in its own 'isolation sandwich'...something underneath and something on top. That is 12 components...each 'isolation sandwich' is slightly different for that particular component. Even my Wilson X1s are on Ultra 5s...but I have also found that adding a 3lb weight inside the woofer port in the back helps 'still' the bass...note: adding 10lbs actually killed the resonance of the bass artificially so there was no natural decay...the bass roll-off just "dropped off" instead which was clearly wrong. I know there is huge vibration on the top of the big woofer cabinet, and if I could find a way to slide an Artesania damper plate underneath the main modules, I would try it.
My two cents. Hope that helps some fellow members who are experimenting with isolation.
(Note: all my electronics are already in a custom rack: 4" thick birch ply sitting on top of 2" slab of slate.)
Here are my own conclusions to date:
1. Isolation Sandwiches work best for me. Basically isolation underneath and damping and often 'mass damping' on top.
2. Each material has slightly sound-related tendencies to either: adjust the tonal balance (typically when made purely of metal) or not to be quite as perfectly clear (pure elastomer only).
3. Mass Damping works extremely well...Adding pure weight on top of a component...but be careful.
When done right, mass damping helps to 'concentrate' the signal. Extraneous vibration are even more controlled/dampened. When its right, you will find a violin string crescendo at the very peak of the note suddenly takes on this INTENSE sweetness even as the note hits the high which normally 'screeches' just a teeny bit. The screech is not the string...its the miniscule vibration that then breaks up that last bit of note. (At least, that's my non-techie way of understanding it).
I actually discovered this when, by accident, I ended up with an extra Auralex platform and stuck it under my Gryphon Colosseum...greater depth (wow!) but lost tonal weight in keyboard. I placed an Artesania damping plate on top...it had helped smaller amps a lot...and it helped (a little). Randomly, I began pressing down on the top of the Gryphon...kinda thinking 'maybe more damping'...at first nothing. Then I kept pressing, and blam!...the strings hit a crescendo and there was this intense purity. I kept releasing and trying...and it kept coming back as soon as I hit that critical amount of pressure. I took a weight scale and placed it on top of the gryphon to understand how much weight I was applying. 20kg.
I have a mirror polished brass weight on top of the Artesania damping plate on top of the Gryphon now.
Now there are definitely some 'watch-outs' with mass damping.
a. Add a few pounds and you may hear absolutely no difference. I found on my components 20kg (45 pounds) makes the difference. Gryphon Colosseum and Tripoint Thor both have 20kg of solid brass on top. The Tripoint manufacturer actually supported my experiment when I told him my findings...I thought like many manufacturers he would deny it. Instead, he confirmed it should work and he does similar things, indicating that no matter how robust the casing, [properly] mass damping will add that extra bit of isolation that should work for the reasons above.
b. I CANNOT put the pure metal on top of any of my cabinets. I always have the brass on top of a well designed damper (Artesania, HRS). Otherwise, the sound hardens...its downright awful. very hard and unforgiving...deadens the decay of notes.
c. on the aesthetic side which for many of us matters...I use mirror polished brass scientific weights. I buy them second hand but in mint condition. I have 76lbs on top of the Velodyne, 45lbs on Gryphon, 45 pounds on Tripoint Thor
4. So what does an 'isolation sandwich' look like typically?
- Underneath: [HRS M3 with Nimbus Couplers] OR [Ultra 5s with HRS Nimbus on top of the Ultra 5s] OR [Ultra 5s on top of Auralex Isolation Platform]. As mentioned above, the Ultra 5s do alter the tonality just a touch in my system...just a teeny leaning out of the lower treble...piano loses weight and feels like electronic keyboard'ish. I read so many great reviews of Ultra 5...after buying them...I found 1 review (on the Stillpoints site!) noting this exact phenomena...and I am fortunate I have managed to fix it in my system because I love the Ultra 5s. Adding the Nimbus Couplers adds ALL that lower treble tonal weight back...but maintains ALL the clarity of the spectacularly clear, delineated Ultra 5
- On Top: HRS double-thickness Dampers, Artesania Dampers and sometimes Ultra 5...and sometimes mass damping too.
Again, I know exactly what tone I want the system to produce...its my primary #1 goal of all...and I find that isolation simply allows that tone to come thru clearer and stronger each time I isolate a component. But along the way to making the sandwich configuration, the tone will change...and it takes experimentation for each component's isolation sandwich to ensure the tone I want is maintained...while continuing to eliminate vibration, grunge, mechanical distortion...which again makes that tone sing thru even clearer, better and more beautifully/purely.
Nowadays, i can demonstrate to visitors that SLIDING AN ULTRA 5 across the top of one component makes a difference. It has become that sensitive to alterations in vibration. The Ultra 5 Distributor who came to visit was extremely surprised.
Conclusion
Every single component in my system is in its own 'isolation sandwich'...something underneath and something on top. That is 12 components...each 'isolation sandwich' is slightly different for that particular component. Even my Wilson X1s are on Ultra 5s...but I have also found that adding a 3lb weight inside the woofer port in the back helps 'still' the bass...note: adding 10lbs actually killed the resonance of the bass artificially so there was no natural decay...the bass roll-off just "dropped off" instead which was clearly wrong. I know there is huge vibration on the top of the big woofer cabinet, and if I could find a way to slide an Artesania damper plate underneath the main modules, I would try it.
My two cents. Hope that helps some fellow members who are experimenting with isolation.
socfan12
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- Apr 5, 2013
- Messages
- 3,579
Jock, interesting. Do you have one of their audio racks (Scuttle or Craz) or just custom amp stands? I like the way they look and was wondering how well they work relative to Ultra 5s under each component on say a less expensive rack.:skeptical:
I love SRA! They take a while to custom do a platform but well worth it. Always double the time they say. For example, they told me 3 weeks for my amp stands for my Cary amps and SO FAR it's been 7 weeks.
socfan12
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Lloyd, thanks for sharing. Fascinating story around isolation. Given the 'isolation sandwich' as you call it, where do you feel is it more important to put the first (and maybe only) layer of isolation, top or bottom? I think bottom, but curious what your findings are.
Cheers
Cheers
Hi Socfan,
Glad to share. My instincts tell me there are 3 primary forms of vibration and that underneath helps the most:
1. Internal to the unit from its own operation.
2. Floor (from the system, external vibrations)
3. Airborne from the system/external
Since all 3 probably end up entering the unit from underneath where it is obviously coupled to the floor (unless you hang your components from the ceiling...
)...I tend to start underneath.But there is a lot from airborne and just hitting the top and sides...and there is internal...where the damping on top also helps 'still' the chassis and thus also the sound and waiver.
Hope that helps...continue to keep asking.
Happy if it helps other people who are looking for ways to focus on their system without changing their equipment or spending that kind of money.
Yes, isolation can be very expensive...BUT, the less expensive end of what I discussed can be a great great start. Namely:
- Auralex Isolation platforms...$60 bucks
- HRS Nimbus/Couplers 2nd hand (few hundred bucks)
- Very heavy weights (on top of damping plates)...few bucks
soundqcar
Member
I am getting excellent results using an Adona Zero GXT rack, and substituting the stock granite shelves with platforms from Symposium, SRA, and Neuance. I have a bunch of the original Stillpoint Universal Dampers laying around. I might eventually screw those into rack and use them as feet for the platforms.
While I'd like to give the Ultra 5's a go, I just can't justify the outlay. Maybe someday, but not in the here and now.
While I'd like to give the Ultra 5's a go, I just can't justify the outlay. Maybe someday, but not in the here and now.
RedSectorA
New member
I use a Minus K for the turntable and spike Sound Will (levitation device) for my components. Overall it does a fine job of isolating everything from ambient vibrations.