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  1. #1

    Speaker break-in

    What are the general thoughts on speaker break-in out there?

    I have a new pair of Totem Model-1 Sigs. Totem recommends (I believe) a 300 hour break-in period.

    Anyone else owned these speakers/experienced dramatic changes over the break in period?

  2. #2
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    My Forest took about 500 hours to get used to the sounds...uh... I mean break in LOL
    Paul

  3. #3

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Haha. Yup.

  4. #4
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    I remember when I upgraded my speakers from PSB Synchrony One to Aerial Acoustics 7T my first thought was, "I paid 10k for this." Basically, this was because they sounded like the PSBs. However, a few weeks later one night I was listening and I sat up straight since it just hit me that they were now sounding much better. Now, a few years later they still sound great as the fronts in the HT, secondary stereo.
    Bud

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  5. #5
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    KobeeDog.......My PMC EB1i speakers in the living room system settled into a permanent voice at about 150 hours and haven't changed a bit since then. My Sonus faber Amati Anniversario speakers in the studio system took quite a few more hours. I felt they reached their permanent voice at about 300 hours, maybe a little more. I believe the biggest part of speaker break-in is having the suspension systems flex and relax into a state where no additional settling takes place. There is really no way to speed it up, either. Just play lots of music at various volume levels until you sense there are no longer any changes in what you hear.
    Dan

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  6. #6

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Been careful not to turn them up too loud so far. I have probably 50 hours on them so far. Not that I'm keeping track that obsessively.

  7. #7
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    I have 5 pairs of speakers and I keep swaping them every week or so.
    My point is , I normally lose track of break-in hours after few swaps.
    Some speakers , such as Spendor, sounds just great out of the box and improves only slightly afterwards.
    For the ATC SCM19 I currently have, it' been almost 3 years now (on and off) and only last week they started sounding right to me.
    I heared Dynaudio also has the same xxx hour break in period.

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  8. #8
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by robhifi View Post
    I have 5 pairs of speakers and I keep swaping them every week or so.
    Is this how you exercise?
    Bud

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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Let's see if we can make some sense of this.

    Can a driver "break in" after one MILLION cycles at a fairly loud volume?

    Even at a low frequency of 20 Hz, that happens in a brief 13.89 hours. A tweeter at 20,000 Hz should require 50 seconds.

    Put on some full spectrum noise, go visit some friends, come home at the end of the day to fully broken in speakers.

    Beyond that, YOU need time to get used to them.
    Listening Room: McIntosh C46, MEN220, MCD500, MR78-Modafferi modified, MPI4, MC602 (2), Pass Labs XVR1 (three-way), tri-amplified Infinity IRS Series V, TailTwister T2X rotator, AtlasSound FMA Rack, dedicated electrical sub-panel, NO TV!

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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFox View Post
    Is this how you exercise?
    Exactly so Bud, that's the kind of audiophile workout one can never get tired of ...

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  11. #11

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by GaryProtein View Post
    Let's see if we can make some sense of this.

    Can a driver "break in" after one MILLION cycles at a fairly loud volume?

    Even at a low frequency of 20 Hz, that happens in a brief 13.89 hours. A tweeter at 20,000 Hz should require 50 seconds.

    Put on some full spectrum noise, go visit some friends, come home at the end of the day to fully broken in speakers.

    Beyond that, YOU need time to get used to them.
    Finally somebody speaking truth about break in!

    Any real break-in happens quickly. The rest is the listener, not the gear, breaking-in.

  12. #12
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor1 View Post
    Finally somebody speaking truth about break in!

    Any real break-in happens quickly. The rest is the listener, not the gear, breaking-in.
    So the talk of over a 1000+ hours of break in time needed for Magico speakers is a bunch of hooey?
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  13. #13
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    The gospel of the gurus has been spoken. No reason to look any deeper into this topic. The truth, that elusive truth, has finally been revealed and we have been set free.

    I don't know about the rest of you but I'm feeling better already. . .


    Dan

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  14. #14
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    So the talk of over a 1000+ hours of break in time needed for Magico speakers is a bunch of hooey?
    This might be true. Just this weekend I am thinking this system has never sounded better. I was wondering if everything was coming together. Since I only use it on Friday and Saturday night, at least in the summer, it takes a while to rack up the hours.
    Bud

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  15. #15

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    So the talk of over a 1000+ hours of break in time needed for Magico speakers is a bunch of hooey?
    IMO, absolutely. I've heard hundreds of pair of speakers that we've built. Within 30 minutes they're 95% of the way there, after 2-3 days of run time they're always 100%. People's auditory recollection is poor, even the best listeners, which explains all you need to know about the myth of these extended break-in periods.

  16. #16
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    So the talk of over a 1000+ hours of break in time needed for Magico speakers is a bunch of hooey?
    How could they even design something if prototypes took 1000+hours (that's 7 weeks 24/7) to break in?

    We'd still be waiting for the first production run.

    When you pay $200-225k for a pair of speakers, and they don't sound as wonderful to you at home as they sounded at the dealer when you decided to plunk down the cash, they need a reason to explain why.

    Your room and your ears are the greatest variables in the system.
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor1 View Post
    Finally somebody speaking truth about break in!

    Any real break-in happens quickly. The rest is the listener, not the gear, breaking-in.

    Are you talking speaker drivers / xover or electronics ...?

  18. #18
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    The whole thing.

    The crossover is a passive device.

    The drivers at least have moving parts.
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  19. #19
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor1 View Post
    IMO, absolutely. I've heard hundreds of pair of speakers that we've built. Within 30 minutes they're 95% of the way there, after 2-3 days of run time they're always 100%. People's auditory recollection is poor, even the best listeners, which explains all you need to know about the myth of these extended break-in periods.

    So what are we talking about 48-72 hrs run time , i would normally agree with that , if by 80 hrs its not good then possibly never , but , i have also experienced drivers breaking in sonically much later than and did require approx another 100-120 hrs to exhibit some sonic consistency , agree 1000 hrs sounds pretty far fetched by some Margin and less face it, if it sounds bad after 3-5 days , it will not turn into Nirvana 1000 hrs later ...



    Regards

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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by GaryProtein View Post
    The whole thing.

    The crossover is a passive device.

    The drivers at least have moving parts.
    The drivers are electro mechanical and do need to have some settling taking place for consistency, xovers will need burn in to form the caps, wires and coils , coils are resonant basturds too , so they do need time to form . Breaking in of audio Components is real , im sure this is not whats being questioned, appear most have issues with the excessive break in hrs necessary by most manufacturers , prolly calculated to beat the return policy


    regards

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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Speaker breakin = 72 hrs or less

    Listener breakin - days or weeks or months depending on your state of mind and the current justification for spending the price of a car for speakers
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  22. #22
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    I wonder what Raidho owners think of the 72 hours or less rule. Speaker break-in
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  23. #23
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    I was always very skeptical about break in.

    So I had to do a test myself.

    15 years ago or so, I bought a pair of Proacs new from a dealer. Instead of taking them home, I set them up at the dealers beside their floor model. Then we all (owner, various salesman and me) would compare the 2 speakers every 10 hours or so during this break in process. We did this for about 3 weeks and it took about 300 hours for us to think that there was NO difference between the floor models and my new speakers.

    The new speakers got so far off from the sound of the floor models that we truly thought they were defective at about the 80-100 hour make. But we stuck with the plan and they truly got to sound the same.

    Just an un scientific test that amazed all of us.

    I've done the same on some amps also - same results except it took only about 75 hours to sound the same.
    Jock

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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    prolly calculated to beat the return policy


    regards
    BINGO !!

    as for the 1000 hr break in …………is that really what Magico says, if so it's more than hooey IMO !
    Cheers ! …. Dave

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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikado463 View Post
    BINGO !!

    as for the 1000 hr break in …………is that really what Magico says, if so it's more than hooey IMO !
    I was just at Magico today and asked Alon Wolf if there is some number of hours of break-in and he just shrugged. He did say it is possible a system can sound better over time, but that was in reply to my saying I felt my system seemed to sound its best now.
    Bud

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  26. #26
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Bud.......A shoulder shrug from Alon Wolf about the break-in period of Magico speakers? What the heck is that supposed to convey? This leaves me with the impression he's unwilling to be quoted about his position on break-in. It certainly keeps him out of the fray.
    Dan

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  27. #27
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Double-D View Post
    Bud.......A shoulder shrug from Alon Wolf about the break-in period of Magico speakers? What the heck is that supposed to convey? This leaves me with the impression he's unwilling to be quoted about his position on break-in. It certainly keeps him out of the fray.
    Agreed. Maybe he didn't hear him? Speaker break-in
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  28. #28
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    Speaker break-in

    The one thing we haven't discussed is the break in time for different driver materials: ceramic and diamond for example - how does their break in period differ? What about beryllium tweeters vs silk dome vs ribbon?
    My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481

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    Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.

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  29. #29
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Double-D View Post
    Bud.......A shoulder shrug from Alon Wolf about the break-in period of Magico speakers? What the heck is that supposed to convey? This leaves me with the impression he's unwilling to be quoted about his position on break-in. It certainly keeps him out of the fray.
    I certainly can't speak for Alon. My impression was he knows his speakers sound great. If others feel they sound better over time then that is their right.
    Bud

    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD
    Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
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  30. #30
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    I've certainly had a gazillion pairs of speakers over the years, and I might be nuts, but I've always found playing vinyl (and the woofer vibrations created) really helps to break in speakers quickly.
    Maybe we didn't worry about speaker break in back in the old days because we were spinning vinyl all the time!
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  31. #31
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFox View Post
    I was just at Magico today and asked Alon Wolf if there is some number of hours of break-in and he just shrugged. He did say it is possible a system can sound better over time, but that was in reply to my saying I felt my system seemed to sound its best now.
    Interesting that someone who will sell you a $300K pair of speakers has no opinion on the subject he is willing to voice.
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  32. #32

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    The one thing we haven't discussed is the break in time for different driver materials: ceramic and diamond for example - how does their break in period differ? What about beryllium tweeters vs silk dome vs ribbon?
    The dome or cone is not what's breaking in, it's the suspension. Drivers with more compliant suspensions will break in faster, ie. fabric surround will break in faster than rubber. But also, there are all different thickness and types of rubber, foam, fabric surrounds. The spider also can be multiple different materials of different thicknesses and compliance.

    But to make a broad strokes statement, a more sensitive speaker will break in faster than a low sensitivity one.

    Also ribbon tweeters don't have any suspension to break in. My experience is that ribbons are 100% or very near it right out of the box.

  33. #33
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Bryan - I think they break in just in time for the next model/$44,000 upgrade. Speaker break-in
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  34. #34
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    I've certainly had a gazillion pairs of speakers over the years, and I might be nuts, but I've always found playing vinyl (and the woofer vibrations created) really helps to break in speakers quickly.
    Maybe we didn't worry about speaker break in back in the old days because we were spinning vinyl all the time!
    Mike, that's because 'in the old days' we were much more into the enjoyment of the music as opposed to way more of the 'equipment hounds' are today
    Cheers ! …. Dave

  35. #35

    Re: Speaker break-in

    I just recently replaced my Totem Fire monitors, speakers I enjoyed for over four years. The dealer who sold me the Totems recommended I not play them really loud for at least 150 or so hours, saying that, if you play them continuously at lower volumes, they would "break in" faster, so I tuned in my favorite classical FM station and let it go for several days.

    Though they were new to me at the time, I must say they DID sound less "restrained" after break in.

  36. #36
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Congratulations on the Focals. Wonderful speakers. What color? Any photos?
    Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.

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  37. #37

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Joe,

    I opted for the black lacquer color, beautifully made product! I ordered them soon after they first arrived in the U.S., had to wait about three months for them, very much worth the wait! My dealer says the wait for the Sopra No2's is up to six months! Waiting for a pair of JL Audio F113V2 sub woofers to arrive! Evan's Audio Electronics-2015-September.jpg

  38. #38
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.

    Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE

    NAD C 658 streamer.

    First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)

    Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.

    Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.

  39. #39
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    Beautiful setup! Thank you.
    Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.

    Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE

    NAD C 658 streamer.

    First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)

    Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.

    Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.

  40. #40
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    My own real-world experience echoes The Professor's post very closely. I bought a brand new pair of ProAc Response 1 SCs back in 2004 (I'm still listening to them) and was deeply disappointed when I got them home and listened for the first time. ProAc recommends about 100 hours of break-in time for these, but getting impatient after maybe 50 hours or so, I took them back to the dealer to inquire what was wrong with them. We hooked them up in the dealer's listening room, and the verdict was that to him they sounded tight and still too new. So I took them home again, played them a LOT over the next week or so, and I remember the moment when I started to hear their real personality. It was quite a revelation, a real "aha!" moment. From then on, I've been a firm believer in speaker break-in time. I imagine different designs behave differently and there's probably a wide range of break-in periods for various speakers. 1000 hours seems like an awful lot, though. (I'm old enough to remember the days when new cars couldn't be driven over 50 mph for the first 500 miles for fear of cracking the engine mounts. Maybe a similar principle at work here?)

  41. #41

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Cooper,

    I had a similar experience with my Totem Fire monitors, brought them home and they just didn't seem to be as "dynamic" as the demo models I auditioned in the showroom, but after a few weeks, they seemed to "relax" some and were noticeably improved.

    I feel that our great hobby is not absent the "snake oil" sellers. Before purchasing the Totem's I never heard about speaker break in times, but I figured, since that recommendation didn't require an additional purchase, it was genuine, and like you, I will take some time to do so every time I purchase new speakers. I am currently waiting for a pair of JL Audio F113V2 sub woofers, when they arrive and get "dialed in", I'll do the same patient break in that I did with my new Focal Sopra No2's, which now probably have about 300 hours on them and to me do sound better than they did when I first received them.

  42. #42
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    Re: Speaker break-in

    I bought a brand new Rel S-2 subwoofer last December and at first it didn't seem to integrate all that well with my ProAcs even after following Rel's detailed instructions about placement and tuning. Having learned my lesson about new speakers though, I knew I'd have to play it for some weeks before it found its true voice. It's now working in seamless concert with the ProAcs. Patience is definitely a virtue with new speakers. As for snake-oil, well that's been with us in one form or another since time immemorial, so we just have to make (hopefully) sensible decisions about these things.

  43. #43

    Re: Speaker break-in

    Cooper,

    Thanks for your valuable insight and input. I am prepared for a longer break in period on my new subs (when they arrive), as I won't be able to play them continuously at a low volume, like I did with my Focal's. I suspect the suspensions on the sub woofer drivers will take even longer to find their "happy place" then those on the main speaker woofers.

    I've had a lot of fun learning about high-end audio, it's been a four year journey since I started down this path, in the process learning gobs about digital audio, DACs, cabling, etc. I've thoroughly enjoyed that journey!

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Speaker break-in

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